TAGGED AS: Marvel, marvel cinematic universe, movies, Superheroes
And just like that, people know what the asterisk in Marvel’s Thunderbolts* means. But like so much of the ongoing story of the Marvel Cinematic Universe, its characters, and even its variants, questions remain.
Yes, even a movie as seemingly simple as Thunderbolts* can still provide a few headscratchers about itself and at least one about things to come. And even that balance feels different, as so often our questions about a Marvel film revolve around what it means for the future. So instead, join us as we debrief the film for the threads that remain before we move on to thinking about The Fantastic Four: First Steps and the eventual culmination of the Multiverse Saga.
Warning: Spoilers for Thunderbolts* Below
Despite her government post, Valentina Allegra de Fontaine (Julia Louis-Dreyfuss) first employed the likes of Yelena Belova (Florence Pugh) and John Walker (Wyatt Russell) to do wetwork for something called the “Ox Group.” At first blush, this would seem to be a name created to sub in for Oscorp — the business run by Spider-Man foe Norman Osborn — as Spider-Man: No Way Home established there is no Oscorp or Osborn family in the 616 universe (the numerical designation of the MCU as of Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness), but there are plenty of other companies in the pages of Marvel Comics that could have served as a replacement for Oscorp. Why Ox Group?
Curiously, a military contractor by that name is not to be found in a Marvel comic book. To be sure, there is an Ox in the Marvel Comics Universe, a sort of utility player who, as a member of The Enforcers and The Fellowship of Fear, tussled with Spider-Man, Daredevil, and other New York-based heroes. And that may give us some insight into what Ox Group did and why Val was so quick to incinerate all when congress wanted to vet her.
Beyond utilizing dubious folks like Ghost (Hannah John-Kamen) and Taskmaster (Olga Kurylenko) to deal with rough spots in their business, Ox Group was dedicated to advancing warfare technologies like Stark Industries or Advanced Idea Mechanics before it. Of course, it is impossible to say if they were direct rivals or more of a quiet military contractor like we have in our own reality. Considering the way Val deals with problems, we imagine the entire company valued discretion above all other things even if one of its goals was creating a new superhero for the post-Avengers: Endgame state of play.
But that leads to one other question: Why did Val want Clint Barton (Jeremy Renner) dead? When she was introduced in Black Widow’s post-credit scene, she sends Yelena to eliminate him — something she attempts to accomplish in the Hawkeye series. Was Clint, as Ronin, getting too close to an Ox Group operation? Did he nearly stumble onto the very project that produced Bob (Lewis Pullman)? And speaking of Val’s early appearances…
Since Val is still the director of the CIA and the minder of the Thunderbolts*, this question may eventually get a more concrete answer: Was she ever a S.H.I.E.L.D. agent?
Those who remember the ABC television series Marvel’s Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. will recall the numerous agents who went rogue following the events of Captain America: The Winter Soldier and the various amounts of spycraft involved for those who truly went rogue and those who were playing all sides while still being loyal to Nick Fury (Samuel L. Jackson).
Back in the comics, Val was introduced as a foil for Fury but would eventually join his organization and work on his behalf even when their connections to S.H.I.E.L.D. waned. This connection is so strong, in fact, that we assumed her Black Widow and Falcon and the Winter Solider appearances were on his behalf. It also surprised us when it never came up in the now-largely disavowed Secret Invasion.
With the reveal of the asterisk, it is clear she is meant to be something of a new Fury for a new era — such as it is — and that some interesting parallels can be drawn between them. Nevertheless, her connection to the worldwide espionage apparatus still suggests a history there that could be explored. Well, provided there is time for that with the remaining film hours before Avengers: Secret Wars.
Come to think of it, is S.H.I.E.L.D. active again? At the end of The Falcon and the Winter Solider, an odd reference is made to Sharon Carter’s (Emily VanCamp) “old division” reforming. At that point, it was easy to assume Val was collecting anti-heroes for a sort of “Dark Avengers” team, but now…
This is a weird one. But in one scene, Congressman James Buchanan Barnes (Sebastian Stan) is working with the head of the committee proposing Val’s impeachment and trying to turn her assistant, Mel (Geraldine Viswanathan), into a witness for the prosecution. The next time we see him, he’s back in Winter Soldier mode firing heavy ordinance at Alexei Shostakov’s (David Harbour) limousine. Consider Val’s weird reference to him as a short-lived representative from Brooklyn and we’re left to ask, did he somehow lose his office?
Add to that his status in the new team and the question gets an underline.
Moreso than any other query we have from the film, this one centers around the filmmaking itself. Since we never see Bucky getting censured or even accused of any wrongdoing, it seems strange for people to call him a failed politician and for him to seemingly give it all up to play mercenary with the ne’er-do-wells.
We imagine there is a sequence missing revealing just how Bucky lost his status and that it has something to do with the late-night impeachment hearing set up halfway through the film, but never seen on screen. Did Mel prove to be an unhelpful witness? Was Val able to spin the whole situation into Bucky still playing spy and questioning his loyalty to the country? In the shape of the film, such a sequence might not fit, but it would easily answer this dangling plot point, especially as it will relate to what Bucky is doing when see the team in Avengers: Doomsday. Of course, Stan has suggested that Bucky felt out of place in Congress and was ultimately happy to suit up again, but that still leaves the how of it missing from the movie.
Or, maybe, those references to his failure were leftovers from another version of the film and, somehow, Bucky can fulfill his duties to the House of Representatives while also clocking in to work as a New Avenger.
Get Matt Murdoch (Charlie Cox) and Jennifer Walters (Tatiana Maslany) on the line for this question straight from the longest post-credit scene Marvel has yet attempted. As we are told in the scene, the New Avengers have been operating for 14 months, but Sam Wilson (Anthony Mackie) and his team will not accept the newbs as true Avengers. There is even mention that he intends to trademark “The Avengers”… but can he?
The original MCU Avengers team was, ultimately, a unit within S.H.I.E.L.D. That division was part of the United States Government — possibly even Homeland Security, although part of the joke back then was Agent Phil Coulson (Clark Gregg) always giving a new explanation and org chart for S.H.I.E.L.D. when asked about it. Nevertheless, taking these things into account, the Avengers were initially operating under the auspices of the government and, in our limited understanding of intellectual property law, could prove the government has claim to prior art regarding the name. Sam’s case could be thrown out before even investing in a legal team to represent him.
Then again, all the business with Hydra invading S.H.I.E.L.D. and Sam’s knowledge of it could also lead to the current administration handing over the name without much of a fuss. That would be the luck of the New Avengers even as they charge off to deal with a new threat from space.
In the wake of Captain America: Brave New World, it was clear Sam was going to recruit a new team of Avengers starting with Joaquin Torres (Danny Ramirez). At the time that film came out, we considered Yelena a key candidate never thinking she’d get a New Avengers team all her own. Now with her and the other New Avengers out of contention, who could he convince to sign on?
We know one person who will literally beg him for the chance to be a true Avenger: Scott Lang (Paul Rudd). His chair was among those revealed in the Endgame cast announcement video and the two characters’ past history will no doubt come into play there. Using the chairs, we also know Chris Hemsworth will be appearing, making Thor a more-likely-than-not member of the team. Bruce Banner (Mark Ruffalo) is also out there raising his son, Skar, but we imagine Sam could persuade him to be a reserve member.
His starting lineup, though, may be more of a shock than we expect. A group composed of Joaquin, Scott, Kate Bishop (Hailee Steinfeld), Shang-Chi (Simu Liu), and Kamala Khan (Iman Vellani) is not out of the question. Yeah, that feels more like a Thunderbolts team than an Avengers lineup, but that could be a plot point revealing the two teams are only separated thanks to Val’s quick thinking in the final moments of Thunderbolts*.
Or, maybe, we’ll learn two teams was always part of Fury’s plan. If he’s still even planning, of course.
While this question will likely be answered in July with its Fantastic Four film, we still have to ponder the final moment of the post-credit scene. In that last shot, the FF’s rocket begins a descent into Earth’s atmosphere with the New Avengers resolving to meet it. The team’s musical fanfare — courtesy of Michael Giacchino — plays, but are the Four really inside?
Yeah, we can’t help but think Doctor Doom (Robert Downey Jr.) is in there for a shocking twist and the Doomsday set up. But it’s equally easy to think Reed Richards (Pedro Pascal), Sue Storm (Vanessa Kirby), Johnny Storm (Joseph Quinn), and Ben Grimm (Ebon Moss-Bachrach) made a cross-reality flight to warn the New Avengers about the impending arrival of Doom.
In either case, the New Avengers won’t have time to worry about trademarks or even Sam’s rival team. They are not ready for Doom.
Thunderbolts* is currently playing in theaters.
